Explore The Power Of Your Coaching Superpower with Dave and Susan Kenney of Emergo Academy

Catharine O'Leary: 00:00:00

Hello, everyone, and welcome back to kickstart the conversation. I am very happy and excited to have Dave and Susan Kenny with me from Emergo Academy. They are clients of mine, they are quiz clients of mine. But more than that they have become close friends. In fact, when I got sick recently it was Susan and Dave reaching out on text to make sure that I was drinking my orange juice and getting my sleep. Which you know, is is an amazing feeling when you can connect with your clients like that and become friends. And one of the reasons why I wanted Dave and Susan on this, this particular podcast was talked to you a little bit more about the client experience of creating a quiz. And exactly what you know, kind of the steps that were involved in, and where we, you know, where we started and where we ended up. And some of the results that they have, because as part of the client collective, and collections, I wanted to make sure you heard from the sources of people that are actually using quizzes. So welcome Dave. And Susan, if, if you can just tell us a little bit more about who you serve and what your business is, I'd be lovely.

Susan Kenney: 00:01:10

So it was an evolution. For us. This is a new brand new business. It's an online business of coaching certification, and specifically, we are certifying recovery coaches. And so because this is a new market for us, we needed to be able to build a list quickly. And one of one of the things that Catharine presented when we met her through another affiliation was the quizzes. And I love quizzes. I am a quiz junkie, I love filling them out. It made a ton of sense to me. Dave is not the quiz guy, he doesn't usually jump on. So this was a new area for him. And, Catharine, you took us through such a cool process. Like, first of all, we can both be headstrong Dave and I have certain ideas about which direction we should go. And you managed to get both of us to align, which is sometimes a feat. And

Dave Kenney: 00:02:13

oh, wait a minute, whoa, whoa, wait a minute. Let's get let's get real here. The two of you are going one way and I was going in another direction. And everybody can see is chocolate in here and us. That's true. But I still stand by the questions for me were logic based questions and not emotional based questions that I had. And I wanted things answered logically. And Catharine, you took the lead and went let's market tests. Absolutely. And the moment you market test is you presented the numbers and I remember you saying as we went and I went, Okay, okay. Oh, that's the winner in the market test. Okay, then that's what we're gonna do. Anyway. That's it. Yeah, that's it. Yeah, pump. Like fall, I want to follow the numbers. And the numbers showed us that, that creating a superhero quiz meaning discover your discovery, your coaching superpowers, yeah, in a positive direction, and not as not as much focused on the pain point as focused more on a strength based solutions, which is, which fits for us. Yeah, that was the winner. And I'm thrilled to have been able to follow the logic and the numbers and eventually, you to one and I came to your site.

Catharine O'Leary: 00:03:21

It was it was less about winning. But I can I can tell you from 30 years of market research experience, the number of times that I have gone in with a theory of what tagline was going to win, what name was going to win what you know what product was going to win or whatever do a focus group or a survey, I can count on one hand how many times I was right. So in the like, 1000s of interviews and and studies I've done, people will surprise you every time because what you think is really cool, will go over their heads or will just go sideways. So it is always always always good. And best practice to do a market test of your quiz hook. But going back to put going back to that that conversation, we spent quite a bit of time on really getting into that 3am question, as I call it that what are people waking up wanting? And what do people or or what are people waking up, you know, worried about or so on? And we had both we had both the negative what am I worried about? What's my pain point, as well as you know, that positive? And then we went off and tested it, but it took us a little while to get there? If I remember correctly.

Susan Kenney: 00:04:36

Yeah. And so you you offered there was different ways to work with you. And one of them was the full out. I'm gonna walk you through this process. And that was the one we went with is this is totally new for us. We have no idea we have no experience in this area. We just want it to work at the end. And your patience at times was tested and it was was wonderful. And you took us through this process beautifully to arrive at a really kick ass quiz at the end like we are using this thing in amazing ways. So yeah, it was it was a neat process. It was a great process for both of us.

Dave Kenney: 00:05:15

You talk about the 3am question, yes, we worked on that and identified that, but you brought a depth of knowledge and wisdom in that. Okay. Let's create some buckets. So we've created four buckets. And as people go through the quiz, they land in one of these four buckets. And what that's about is what motivates them. And so now, the marketing and communication behind that fits for them. Not all, not all emails, and not all communication. So in other words, let me let me be more precise, if somebody's really interested in making an impact as a coach, that's one thing. And if somebody's really interested in making an income and having freedom in their life, yeah, that's a totally different communication. And you helped us understand that. And you showed us how any, it's we're not talking anything sleazy. Here, we're talking just about being smart about helping people self identify what motivates them. And now we're able to explain how we can service that.

Catharine O'Leary: 00:06:17

Yeah, and that's, and that's the, the, the, I mean, we call it segmentation. But you know, that that is getting to that personalization, and customization of your marketing messages is really what what the gold at the end of the rainbow is for any, you know, any quiz, any segmentation of your list, any way that you can make sure that you are talking to your ideal client, like they're a person, like they have, like, you know, priorities, they have land, you understand those? That's where the, you know, the magic happens. And you you're, and I don't know, you can talk to this, but your messaging and your ability, like your, your creative flow to create those messages, create those emails, and so on, does it become easier?

Susan Kenney: 00:07:03

Oh, yeah. Yeah, absolutely. We also have a live video that shows afterwards, so people go through, it's a very quick process, it's 60 seconds or less that they fill in the questionnaire. But what happens afterwards is the communication that by the time I because there's a call to action, at the end, we're asking people to call us to get more information. And though by the time we get those calls, or those emails, they already feel connected today. Well,

Dave Kenney: 00:07:33

Can Can we can we explain the great thing that the presentation I did and how that evolved? Because that leads right into what you're talking about. Do I jump into that? Catharine?

Catharine O'Leary: 00:07:43

Yeah, sure. Go ahead, please.

Dave Kenney: 00:07:44

So I had an opportunity professionally to speak to a group of people and it's a new group of people thought it would be a good group of people. For us. It was a home run, you speak about this, I'd rather talk to a smaller room. And this was 247 people ended up here as it was a 90 minute talk that I did, as a featured speaker. And at the end of the talk. Well, let me put it this way the talk was spot on, because it really resonated with the audience. I was talking to the right group of people, it doesn't have to be a room of 10,000. I don't want that. I want a group of two room of 247. We're all nodding their heads and all alert, and all asking questions. And that was it was an incredible conversation. At the end of that I offered a free gift, just a gift. And the gift was our quiz. And the result of that was mind blowing to us. So to me the numbers here, Catharine 247 people there, and we converted it a 36% conversion, took the quiz started the quiz, I should say started it. So 91 People started the quiz. That's a phenomenal number anytime you speak. But here's the catch out of that 92% of that group, completed the quiz and submitted their data. So we have them added to the list. But now they've self identified, and they're really interested. And then from that, so we've got 91 People started at 84 completed it. And then Susan, you got some phone calls.

Susan Kenney: 00:09:20

Yeah. Phone calls. And it felt like because we have our own podcast too. So when we initiated the podcast years ago, it changed the conversation with people once they heard us. This is exactly the same conversation. This is what I felt. I said, Catharine like these people are already feeling connected. They feel like they know us. They feel like we have some expertise that we position ourselves in the market differently. Each phone conversation was very, very comfortable. I wasn't having to sell anything. This that was done already.

Catharine O'Leary: 00:09:59

And all In 60 seconds,

Susan Kenney: 00:10:02

how about 60 seconds.

Dave Kenney: 00:10:03

But the quiz identifies people strengths, coaching strengths. So somebody could be a great communicator, some go to be score high in empathy. And they were you soon You said they were all identifying with that. And then while they remember the other thing they were identifying with,

Susan Kenney: 00:10:17

yeah. So on the on the other side of that, we took the superpower information and said, This is your kryptonite. So here's what you're great at. Here's what you need to be cautious about, right? You can burn yourself out by doing this, or you may turn off clients if you do this. Everyone identify identified with the kryptonite. It was it was it brought this different element to the conversation? So not only did I find out my strength, and most people said, Yeah, I didn't know that that was a strength. Thanks for pointing out that that strength can also have kryptonite. So that was the game changer in our conversation. So so we took the 3am question, but we did something different with it, to identify to them, this is your problem. And we can help you with

Catharine O'Leary: 00:11:08

that. Yeah. And and I think that that's, that's the beauty of as they go through, they're there. They're going through a little bit of self discovery journey. Right? They are like, so. So yes, they kind of already know, their superpower if they're, you know, empathetic, or intuitive, or a great communicator, and so on. But they also, I mean, they're kind of in the back of their mind going okay, but what are you going to give me like, what what do I get to learn? What what do I what am I taking away from this as a lead magnet? Um, that's not the words they use, but and the way that I mean, it's just framing the challenges, right? So, you know, like, it's the struggles are the challenge, you framed it brilliantly as kryptonite. And now you're able to say, but you know, you have this, but this is where you're struggling. And we can help you solution by doing you know, XYZ, just really quickly, here's a couple of things. You can walk away, we can never talk again, but less off you go. Or you can get on a call and learn some more about what's going on. Right. And I know, David, I you and I talked about that. That one. That one event having a 92% convert, like you know people that start the quiz to finish the quiz. That's super high, folks. That's like, that's really making sure that you are in the right room that you are in the your ideal clients room. But not everyone took the quiz and that's okay.

Dave Kenney: 00:12:41

But but the Catharine beyond that. So nice. So 19 92% completed the quiz. That's the quiz performing, no matter how great the talk is, we can tie with the best widget to the widget audience of the world. If they land on the quiz, and the questions don't resonate, or they seem empty and candy or they can or they know where you're going after the first question or two people drop off going, there's no value here. I believe that yes, we went fishing in the right place. Okay. And yes, they they arrived. But the quiz itself, the questions are word and you've you've helped to shape the questions in a way that cause them to actually think. And that in that hook, that engagement allows a 92% conversion. So I credit the conversion. While I credit me for getting the show up. Okay, let's look sorry. But yeah, that's right. I credit the quiz on the 92% conversion, because it doesn't matter if they land there and think it's cheap and cheesy and sleazy. They will.

Susan Kenney: 00:13:45

The testament to that is everyone that I have had conversations with or has emailed, said, You nailed me. That is my superpower. So it wasn't just a rant we didn't as the three of us were crafting this message. It wasn't just a random, there was so much thought and effort put into the the word choice that made the big difference.

Dave Kenney: 00:14:06

Well, let's get into the thought. The thought is this quiz is based on positive psychology. The positive psychology talk is a strengths based approach in life. If my strength is a communicator, if my strength is intuition, if it's empathy, then lean into being an empathetic coach, however, learn and understand where your shortcomings are, where the challenges are, so that you can improve and be stronger and and that's what that's what this this quiz is a positive psychology based quiz, which brings great value, which again supports why I'm saying the quiz itself. nailed a 92% which is an unbelievable number. Conversion Rate.

Catharine O'Leary: 00:14:51

Yeah, and it's still fun. Like people's people still like lead. They still get their superpower they still get their kryptonite they still get to learn a little bit and it's still serious. It's still like a business quiz. It's not you know what 80s Rock Band Are you? Um, it's um you know, Duran Duran sorry, but it's actc

Susan Kenney: 00:15:14

as more of a bully. Oh, yes.

Catharine O'Leary: 00:15:18

It is. It is a vehicle it is a way to introduce the the academy to a new to a new, you know, a new batch of people in a way that is fun, that is entertaining that is innovative. And Dave you said like, you know, in a in a crowded space, being able to stand out is key. And really kind of nailing you know, the intention of the academy in

Dave Kenney: 00:15:49

but it is a fun, intense, it is a fun inter exchange, the whole theme of superpower you one could say it's a little over overplayed. But it's I don't believe it is in at least in this case. And the ability to use the word kryptonite is a fun way of say, Here's your shortcomings. Here's your pitfalls. Here's your downfalls which are terrible phrases to use. Yeah, where are your challenges? Yeah. And it also says one of the greatest superheroes, Superman himself had some shortcomings and it's okay. So so it is really a fun way to package all of this, by the way, the PDF that got sent, we worked a lot with you worked a lot on that Katherine. And we did too, in honing in on on every word, and making sure that that it resonated with people, and it was relevant to people and yet it also moved them through law knowing themselves as a coach, but also moving through the sales cycle with us.

Catharine O'Leary: 00:16:50

Yeah, yes. And, and so this is one of the things that, you know, when we talk about lead magnets, and we talk about, you know, checklists or PV, you know, you know, the blueprints or whatever, a quiz, if you're, if you're going to sit down and do it as a strategic lever to use in your business, it's gonna take you more than a weekend. Right? It's gonna, if you're gonna have to do some digging into your 3am what your clients 3am question, you're gonna have to challenge some of the, you know, some of the thoughts of Oh, I think it's this, I think it's that you might have to test some things to get to get down. And I know that Dave, you and I went back and forth on How many questions do we have? Do we need this one? And we were hardcore, you know, you know, with with you on, like, with, with this quiz? Don't say, is that question a million dollar question. Does it deserve million dollar real estate? Because if it doesn't, it's out. Right? Well, right. And we made some hard, you know, we made some decisions. We,

Dave Kenney: 00:17:59

we engaged with you, Catharine, because of your background, your expertise, your knowledge, and we and we wanted to pay for that. And tap into that. And I didn't want to spend, you know, months learning 10 years of information about consumer behavior, you brought that to the table. And why I say that is for me, I thought, Oh, God, if we have a quiz, you're gonna have 50 questions like, it's got to be of substance and you're going no, no, no, no, no, no, no, hang on. Here's about consumer behavior. And so it's not just the quiz when people engage with you. It is that decades of background of experience that you bring to the table. And you made a lot of sense in listen to 92% conversion. I gotta admit it, Catharine, you are right.

Catharine O'Leary: 00:18:52

Oh, I am framing that. That's the Audiogram and then right. Might have to get a tissue.

Dave Kenney: 00:19:06

And a lot of stories we could show. But that's but what right now what we're doing laughing This is how we work together. That also comes with the package. Why not have fun? While we're working? Smart? Exactly.

Susan Kenney: 00:19:19

I, here's what I feel as and you don't even know this what I'm about to share. But I feel like you've got my back. In our new business, we had to strategically decide because we had a very small budget. We had to make the best decisions possible about where our resources go. And what's going to bring us the most qualified leads. And we love that we went with you there because there was a lot of options right? There was a lot of people saying, Oh, we can get this and we can help you. You delivered more than we would have imagined and it's going to continue and and I look forward to this quiz evolving over the next coming months to as our as our course grows.

Catharine O'Leary: 00:20:07

Yes. And the course is growing and and so, everyone, guess what, there's a free gift event you get guess what it is?

Susan Kenney: 00:20:17

Is it a superpower,

Catharine O'Leary: 00:20:20

it might be a superpower quiz. But yeah, if you can, we'll put that in the show notes. And if you could maybe just give the folks at home. Just a little bit more about the academy and kind of the, the, the, you know, how to work with you and what you are offering.

Susan Kenney: 00:20:40

Go for that. So we have an online eight week certification course, that is accredited by two bodies. One is Kairos. University. So if anybody needs to get some university credits, we got you covered. And also a governing body for addictions in the US called NAIDOC. So you get accreditation through them. So the end of the eight weeks and see us and see us, for people that need those. At the end of the eight weeks, you will walk away with some solid knowledge on how to be a recovery coach, like really, truly how to help people recover from life's challenges, whether that is addiction related, whether that's anxiety, depression, grief, eating, whatever that is, whatever they're recovering from. And, and then, if you love that we have a longer course. So we have for somebody that wants it as a career. And as is wanting more information, we also have a year long.

Catharine O'Leary: 00:21:45

So this is this can be your focus. Or it can be a tool in your toolkit of all your other coaching, correct? Absolutely.

Dave Kenney: 00:21:55

Well, what's a life coach? Is it and I'm a life coach. But what is life coach, it's a very generic title. And life coaches, the number right now in the industry is anywhere between 60 to 70% of certified life coaches struggling to make any kind of income. And part of that is that you're not talking about solving a problem as a life coach. You know, a good life coach actually gets ahead of the problem. It's not a crisis management issue. A recovery coach offers you the specialty to help people in crisis number one, and also even if you're a therapist, because we work we've trained a lot of therapists and psychologists and social workers. In those fields, there are a lot of issues about trauma, addictions related self destructive patterns, choices, habits. And we will teach you how to come from a brain first approach to help your clients become their best.

Susan Kenney: 00:22:55

Here's what we've done. We've funneled Catharine, you had many, many years of experience. We ran a recovery and wellness program residential for a decade, Dave and I had a team, big team, we lived with people 24/7 We have knowledge, intimate knowledge about recovery, that I don't think you're going to find anywhere else. And we are as brilliant as condensing that as you have been increasing our wonderful

Catharine O'Leary: 00:23:21

quiz. So if you if you are thinking of coaching and want to get more information, or you are a coach or a therapist and want another tool in the toolkit, I do suggest reaching out and taking the quiz and finding out what your superpower is, finding out what your kryptonite is and then get on get on a call with emerge Code Academy and figure out how to how to move forward because if you're

Dave Kenney: 00:23:49

Yeah, if we're a good fit, right, I'd love to chat. But even just for coaches and professionals who want to maybe identify their strengths and their kryptonite, what's offered is again, it's it's positive psychology brain based, it has value to you. And if that helps you in your career, wonderful if we can help you in your career. Wonderful. So, Katherine, but the other part we haven't talked about is working with you, has been a blessing has just

Susan Kenney: 00:24:17

said she's got her back. That's what I feel like, I feel like I feel like you this is a professional relationship has turned into a personal relationship, but because of your expertise, we just feel so comfortable with you

Catharine O'Leary: 00:24:33

land for tomorrow. And as am I looking forward to two more because we're gonna get the quiz out there and we're gonna get it everywhere. And you know, here's, here's the thing, folks. The we're coming out of the pandemic, we are unsure, honestly, what that three years or two and a half years has has done to people to to, you know, relationships with food relationships with alcohol relationships with each other. And there are, you know, we need people to make sure that there are people being heard, like, there are places to get our needs.

Susan Kenney: 00:25:18

Yeah, yeah, it's detrimental. Right now, we know the numbers coming back, as you said, there are a lot of people in crisis. And this is a way to serve them, and have a wonderful career that gives you freedom and flexibility and all of the things that are important to you.

Catharine O'Leary: 00:25:36

Yeah. So I do urge you to reach out if that is that is in your wheelhouse, and or if it's even of interest, reach out. So, Dave, Susan, any last, you know, kind of not last words, that didn't sound right. Any final thoughts?

Susan Kenney: 00:25:57

Gotta bring it on home.

Dave Kenney: 00:25:59

Just the the 92% conversion is a, but there are big numbers in that room. And big numbers that took the test isn't wasn't, this isn't a 92% of of eight people. This is a significant number. And I believe everybody can attain these numbers and these conversions with a quiz. If you put the time in, you do the market research. And when you find the right spot, you find your sweet spot. And this is also helped us change. But you don't know this, Catharine, this has helped us change and free focus our market because we were kind of doing more of a shotgun approach. Looking for people, we've now narrowed it down more of like a bullseye approach based based on this group and and their hunger to learn more for what we do. Gosh, no, we all want that. Yeah, so Exactly. So I really do believe if you put the work in, you do the testing, the only other things we could have, we talked about doing this through learning your programs and kind of do it on ourselves. But we don't get the real individual wisdom that you bring to the table. Yeah, and there isn't more of an investment than what not, it's not a huge amount more. But there is it's not a cost, it's an investment. And the return on that has been it's not even close to x factor. So for what if you're on the fence, and if you can pull it off lean into working with Catharine personally directly. He she puts in far more than she, by the way ever promises and, and really invested in one and make it work?

Catharine O'Leary: 00:27:40

Well the best compliment that I Oh, sorry. Go ahead. Susan.

Susan Kenney: 00:27:43

I was gonna add, here's, as you were talking, what has given us the ability so everybody does speaking gigs, you're invited on podcast, those things, if that's what you want to do in business, offering a link to a quiz at the end makes you look really professional. And it helps people instead of just putting your contact information at the end, you have given something as a gift to them. And you've opened up the conversation even greater. So I think adding the quiz at the end of any speaking engagement has changed how people are receiving us